both sides of the coin was Re: [IMPROVEDX] Doctor lectures Valley health professionals on dangers of errors

Peggy Zuckerman peggyzuckerman at GMAIL.COM
Wed May 17 18:15:46 UTC 2017

The unaddressed issue in every medical encounter is the uncertainty that
exists. There have been and will continue to be wondrous gains in the
medical world that benefit us all.  But, the diagnosis and treatment of the
billions of different people, under multiple circumstances, and in the
dynamic changing individual body newly paired with a treatment of any kind
is a task that exemplifies uncertainty.

A clear(!) recognition of uncertainty, both in the medical world and the
individual's world would go a long way to create an atmosphere of
partnership.The notion that the doctor knows all, and that medicine is
infallible, has been costly to everyone.  The patient who comes to realize
that this is not true feels betrayed, which exacerbates the situation.

When we can comfortably discuss the uncertainty of the diagnosis, of the
treatment options, of the variables that the patient has, then we can begin
to make progress towards the 'best possible' outcomes.  The human and
financial losses that occur cannot be tolerated.  This requires the right
of the patients to partner in every medical interaction to the fullest
extent is the basis for the fix of healthcare.

Peggy Zuckerman

Peggy Zuckerman

On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 9:38 AM, Vic Nicholls <nichollsvi2 at> wrote:

> Tom I say this because health care is expensive. Its not like 100 years or
> more ago when people did home remedies and death was simply a part of life.
> We frankly have to admit the hard fact: the US cannot support paying for
> all the health care of people. Hard decisions have to be made. Gotta draw
> the line, and vaccination is a perfect example.
> In addition, do you know the Somali reaction to the anti vaxxers? They
> were mad. They realized they got taken advantage of. They realized that
> doctors can be trusted.
> So sad. It didn't have to happen. It can be stopped.
> I am a harmed patient in more ways than one. Yet I want doctors to own up
> and fix mistakes. You don't do yourselves as a profession any good when
> people realize mistakes were made because that's why they won't trust you
> for anything. I don't want people to throw the baby (doc) out with the
> bathwater (all medical info/research). That's what I've seen a lot of them
> do: every sort of woo they'll hold onto because of harm from the/one
> medical establishment. It grows into the massive disaster that is anti
> vaccination, autism causes, etc.
> It starts by saying we are adult enough, as Tom put below, to stand up for
> our mistakes and show others how to react.
> Vic
> On 5/17/2017 9:10 AM, Tom Benzoni wrote:
> Maybe getting a bit tangential, but Vic brings up an interesting question.
> One feature that differentiates adults from children in a major way is
> taking responsibility for one's own choices (and conversely, not taking
> responsibility for other's choices, but that's a topic for another day.)
> Rather simple solution: If a person, family or group opts out of
> vaccination (not true medical exemption) they could post a bond. An actuary
> could price this out; we can with carbon credits. This bond could be posted
> by the entity proposing (in the way an employer bonds her employees) or
> bought a la carte. This would give an air of legitimacy to the anti-vaxxers
> I think they'd welcome. Don't drink from a trough you don't help fill.
> tom
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